I decided to post a response on Zygor forum so we can settle it like grown men.


Dugi: Hi Everyone this is Dugi from UltimateWoWGuide.com, not sure if anyone though I have the guts to come and post it here.

main reason for me to post here is which what I have always wondered where things went wrong.

Things turned sour when UltimateWoWGuide.com began to post graphs comparing their products to Zygor products in a way that portrayed Zygor Guides products as being dramatically inferior to Dugi’s products. We didn’t understand what possessed the owners of UltimateWoWGuide to take such a stab at us for no reason but it was clear from then on that they were not interested in any sort of affiliation.

So John is this the real reason that started this whole thing? it seemed so stupid. What graph are you talking about? do you meant the X and Ticks comparison that you have about Joanna, Brian Kopps, TeamIdemise and Our Guide?

I learned this practice from you when you first put it up, and we simply followed, we also made sure everything was accurately stated. We were fine with it on our side because it was accurate but if you wanted it down all you had to do was ask. Just like we have ask you many times, but you never response to our emails, I’m not a mind reader, why don’t you ever contact me John and settle it this professionally.

I contacted you so many times for us to do business together, which would have worked so well. But I again I had no idea there was some sort of grudge, which was odd because you set the standard yourself.

Zygor: Dugi, unfortunately, this issue, combined with past issues we’ve had, have simply escalated too far. We made an effort to keep all of this strictly professional by having our legal team contact you directly behind the scenes, so as not to advertise your inner business workings like this. And then this issue turned into a circus with the blog posting, and continued distribution of our software, which you still have not ceased.

So, we do not have any interest in further debating this with you on our public community forum. We will return to treating this issue strictly professionally and allow our legal team to handle it from here on.

Take care.

After ward I made an additional post

Dugi: Your own members already though your actions were underhanded before my blog was live. How can we resolve a problem if we don’t communicate with each other,  I’m an old fashion man if I have a problem with someone I talk to them directly not hiding behind lawyers.

You only gave us 48 hours to comply with your demands, you know well that will cripple our business income and other website owner. If you don’t consider you actions low-down, *****, mean, hateful, or anything similar. (that was quoting his own words in the post) .

If you’re really the nice guy that you portray yourself to be, please allow us at least two weeks from now to give us time to adjust and build a new guide.

However my final post was deleted and the thread is now locked and I’m not surprised.

    12 replies to "So I posted on Zygor’s Forum"

    • Spyder

      Just curious if anyone has read the rules to add-ons set by blizzard?

      source: http://www.worldofwarcraft.com/policy/ui.html
      It appears to me that some peeps haven’t read the rules to making an add-on for WoW. What is with these guides trying to make money for add-ons. I understand the need for money but add-ons are supposed to be for the community by the community. If you need money then go program a real program. (My opinion on the matter which amounts to nothing except gold in my eyes.)

      • DugisGuide

        this topic have been debated and discussed a lot, I’d like to stay on topic with this post. To answer it quickly is that the addons are free and the guides is what you’re paying for. We believe that the addon policy is a useless defence for us as it is not the law its just Blizzard’s policy.

        its one of the reason we decided not to build our own addon earlier and rather use TourGuide which is obviously a free addon, we have plans to allow other guide makers to distribute our addons for free if they want to, however this is not set in concrete yet.

    • Ryan Lee Wade

      Dugi, I completely and totally agree that it was a *****, cruel, hateful thing to do. He had to remove your post just not to get flamed and then close the topic xD. You have THE best guide on WoW period. Daily, leveling, gold, and PvP. That guy ain’t getting a **** penny from me!!! I love all your guides and how professional and varied they are and hope you get past all the legal problems and continue to make the best guides on the web for WoW.

      Your customer and guide tester/rater,
      Ryan Lee Wade

    • B

      The real loser here is going to be Tekkub. For a quick buck, his addon will be dead after Zygor’s contract has end. Everyone else will have moved on to newer and better things.

      It’s a shame really.

    • Jack

      Ok now here is the big question whatever the outcome of this is… You keep without a working legal addon at the moment (apart that you say you working on your own one… it is not DONE yet).

      The addon you using now got legal issues of you got the sale rights or not…

      1. Will you return money to clients that buy this addon and after reading all this want there money back? Will you honor your 30 days no good money back agreement?!

      2. Will you stop all sales of this addon (I think its use in all your guides?). And like you got legal issues things look to be like the right move is shut down all sales of this guides that include the addon. Well until the addon you say you working on is done!

      • Dugi

        All we had received was a notice from John Cook which in short, “TourGuide is now mine please remove it from your website within 48 hours” which we comply exactly within 48 hours. However we did send a signed counter notice stating that we have good faith and believe that this notice is a mistake. Reason for this is that we were not aware that Zygor have taken over as we have not received any form of notice from Tekkub the original owner as we have only confirmed this news yesterday. sounds fair?

        Will you close your business and just because someone sends you a notice that they own certain rights without proof?

        Now that tekkub have posted his notice on board, we have since closed all sales for our leveling guide and daily guide although officially we were waiting for someone to actually contact us, with a follow up proof of licencing.

        I challenge you to find anyone that we have refused a refund on. they don’t exist.

        • Jack

          I am sorry Dugi for all this. I did study law and a close down is always good to cover your butt in case things go to trail. It shows good faith even when you was not able to complete check the proof.

          However I got a tip for you do not go after Zygor. This issue is a clear case of greed on the guy that did make this addon.

          Point 1: He release the addon like freeware without any licensing. By law its like you give someone that download it full right to do WHATEVER they want with it! It also in some states make him loss all right on controlling it.

          Point 2: Like this not was a full function software and needed a product of “first party”. The first party software rights apply to this software. One of the policy’s of the first party and ****** software state that they not will allow to make money off it in any way. Include get money for services.

          Point 3: Your never did sale his software in anyway or form you did offer it for free download on your site and make the proper renaming to make sure that his name was not put on it in anyway. (and you was in your right to do with it whatever you want).

          Point 4: Like you did make changes to the addon over time the addon in question is no longer the addon he did make but a complete new product! (yeah really the laws are outdated on this one still)

          Point 5: He can not sale what he does not own… Zygor may think he is smart but Dugi addon is more a clone of that addon and his rights do not apply to it.

        • Raventiger


          Just wanted to make a quick post to wish you the best. This move by Zygor has affected a lot of guides, both commercial and otherwise.

          I’ve never tried your guide, but I have to say I wasn’t impressed with Zygor’s guide, and even less impressed that with the hoops I had to jump through after Zygor ignored my repeated requests for a refund (even though I was asked for that refund well within the allotted time period).

          Hopefully this situation will resolve itself in your favor. Don’t give up, and don’t let yourself be bullied.

    • crystaltech

      well i still say if blizz gets wind it will block it from being run in game. and since the code is useless with out worldofwarcraft. it will rot, and any attempts to fan update will be shot down. tourguide is dead, move on with something better but make sure its minmal i don’t like bloat.

    • J

      Tek freely published the source publicly without any form of license being included or even copyright information. That quite possibly puts the source close to being in the realm of public domain.

      • Jethro

        Actually, as a software developer myself, I can assure you that is not true. The author of the software always holds the copyright unless they say otherwise somewhere. Just because they don’t specifically detail any form of license does not mean someone can just take the code and release it bundled with their sold works.

        Dugi has disappointed me. Not because he made a mistake, he’s human, and anyone can make a mistake, but because after he basically admitted he was in the wrong he hasn’t made things right. He is still emailing out the files which Zygor appears to now own.

    • TZZDC

      I’m not surprised either business is business when it comes down to it and everythings settled with who ever has the better lawyer and not who can work it out face to face.

      You’re Johns competition even if you both respect each other and have face to face dealings with the past you’re still competition and in the business world its all about money and success.

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